- Photo © Paul Mpagi Sepuya
GO’B: One of the things I’ve observed in the last 30 years, I guess as a consequence of gay liberation, those kids you see who are like 22 you don’t know if they’re straight or gay. It’s wiped out codified behaviour and stereotypes. It’s more mysterious.
GP-O: We’ve noticed that, for example, in the Village Voice sex ads for a long time it was almost always biological female girls offering sex for heterosexual guys. Slowly but surely over the last ten to fifteen years it’s become something like 60 percent she-males. Yet the clientele are still almost all heterosexual. So what does that mean in terms of the evolution of the species, their desires, and their potential future? Burroughs once said to me, ‘This is your task: how do you short circuit control?’ Talking with Jaye about this we thought, maybe control is actually DNA. Burroughs was so much into cutting things up, and if you cut up the body and then redesign it, you deny DNA’s power to say what you’ll look like. And instead of it being about clothing, you could say, ‘Let’s grow fur, or feathers’.
GO’B: Be careful here Gen, because you’re playing into the hands of the Republicans because they’ll say, ‘If we give them gay marriages then they’ll want to marry their pets!’
GP-O: Are the Republicans somewhat afraid of tinkering with the gene pool? Weird to think that where it used to be underground LSD labs we’re going to have to have underground genetic labs.
GO’B: I think straight guys like transvestites or transsexuals because they grew up watching Marilyn Monroe and Kim Novak and these exaggerated forms of femininity and they got turned on by it, but women aren’t like that, so the most feminine out there are men, because for them it’s an art. They put everything into it and that’s very rare among women.
GP-O: For us it’s 24/7, even without Jaye’s body here physically continuing. We’ve been travelling the world with that movie, it’s won nine prizes and been sold out everywhere. Something is going on, people are reassigning the way they imagine gender and they’re comfortable with it. They see a movie about me and Jaye starting to have surgery to look more and more like each other and declaring that we are one being in two halves, and they come out crying because it’s a wonderful love story. Back then, at the dungeon I worked as a telephone girl under the name Lady Sarah, to see what I was passing as and what we could get away with, and we actually did quite a few sessions with heterosexual men who thought that I was a biological woman dominatrix, sometimes with me and Jaye together. It was hilarious and hard not to giggle, you know it’s a pretty ridiculous situation already and then we wondered what would happen if we suddenly said, ‘Do you know you’re being fucked with a dildo by a man, technically?’ They would probably freak about and go, ‘That’s not what I paid for!’ Problem is that we did it together with Jaye for so long that it would be too emotional to do it without her, which is a real drag because I really could do with the money. Perhaps we’ll get over it when the bills start coming. So maybe you’ll hear about Lady Sarah the cruel English mistress again. Because of course the story was that I was an English school mistress from public school, and I can be very convincing, especially with the caning.
GO’B: I have a friend who’s a writer, he grew up and went to school in England and he said that at the beginning of term they gave a speech to the boys because they didn’t want them to go into town and have sex with the town girls, so they told them, ‘For God’s sake, if you absolutely must have sex, have it with a boy!’
GP-O: That’s Britain! Lad culture.
From Sleek 31 “XX/XY”